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Togusa, you fool!
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Should Togusa implant at least some Cybernetics?
It would only seem logical in the type of job he works at
23%
 23%  [ 5 ]
Of course not, it goes against his principals
76%
 76%  [ 16 ]
Total Votes : 21

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Saito



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not only does Togusa provide a balance being more human, but also he is a balance emotionally. He's married with a family, he's sentimental, and he has sometimes shown a short fuse.

The creators of SAC went to a lot of trouble to put emphasis on this in every installment at some stage. In the 1st Gig it was the death of his former colleague in the police department (I may have missed out something else there - there's something else in the back of my mind but it is also 8am Wink ), in the 2nd Gig it was the court case and the problem of sticking *too* closely to his principles, in SSS it is the situation with his daughter (which I found especially moving). Section 9 can seem a cold and functional place sometimes, I think Togusa ads a healthy dose of human emotion to the whole thing.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would *never* get cyber implants if I was in their world, even being part of Section 9. Why? Because people get hacked ALL THE FRICKIN' TIME, and then they get made to do crazy things like blow their own heads off. Not being cyberized is a way of protecting yourself from being a victim of such things. I might own a computer and any computer could potentially get viruses, but I am not going to stick the computer with that potential in my head. I mean, the idea that there's the potential for someone to get into your head and do what they did to Togusa (good scene, btw) and the other victims in SSS is horrible and just not worth the advantages, particularly as it happens fairly often (I think by all rights he'd have those things removed in the next series). Only the Major and Aramaki seem to not have anything seriously bad happen them like that, and even then with her "skills" she is not entirely safe... No way.

Actually wanting a cyberbrain unless you need it (ie you are dying or something) is for geeks... Making a "back-up" of yourself on the other hand sounds cool... (like my fave X-Men character Shard, lol)
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sylphisonic wrote:
I would *never* get cyber implants if I was in their world, even being part of Section 9. Why? Because people get hacked ALL THE FRICKIN' TIME, and then they get made to do crazy things like blow their own heads off....
Only the Major and Aramaki seem to not have anything seriously bad happen them like that, and even then with her "skills" she is not entirely safe... No way.

Actually wanting a cyberbrain unless you need it (ie you are dying or something) is for geeks... Making a "back-up" of yourself on the other hand sounds cool... (like my fave X-Men character Shard, lol)


There you go geek-bashing again Wink

I think like anything, it's a matter of balancing perspectives. There is a risk that cyberbrain attacks could compromise you, and whereas a computer is not physically attached to you, your brain is your life, so it's a much more serious issue. You have to understand though that in the setting of GiTS having a cyberbrain is almost a requirement in order to integrate into society. Those without are often portrayed in GiTS as outcasts or are often too poor or socially disadvantaged to afford such things. in the GiTS universe I get the feeling everything happens on the 'net, and if you aren't on it you aren't there. Cyber brains are far from the reserve of geeks and nerds (they probably were 20-30 years pre-GitS however), but instead are an essential tool for living in the modern world.

Change brings risk. Risk is always measured in some way. My impression is that it is overridden by the vast advantages in the GiTS timeframe.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
There you go geek-bashing again


VWA HAH HAH!!! Yes! You see, it is because I am *evil* like I said Twisted Evil . No really it is all just a personal attack on you Arrow tries to inflict pain on this "saito-geek" Arrow Wink

Quote:
essential tool for living in the modern world.


Yeah... you may be right. I think my head is always more in the first movie's world, where it did not feel outwardly obvious that cyberbrains were a virtual essential in life and so you didn't really think about it that way much. SAC would seem to be a bit more heavy on the cyberisation front. I still think that would be awful, and it strikes me as being a bit unbelievable (both in terms of the expense, and in that I don't think that such a large majority of people would ever possibly want to have cyberbrains in their heads to have caused that situation where it's an 'absolute essential' in the first place). I just don't think people would want to mess with their brains, and especially not when hacking proves to be so common (almost nobody but Section 9 could afford Section 9 level protection, for one thing). And apart from some medical benefits and added communications ability, I just don't see what the real advantages are for the common person. Why a person in general feel a great need to shove what they could carry in their handbag (GPS, credit card, cel phone etcetera) inside their brain? So they can get access to stuff that tiny bit quicker? It seems like a trivial, shallow reason. But it is a fictional world, not the real one- so I guess if the rules they're under say they're outcasts without the things, that's how they'll behave.


Last edited by sonic on Sun Feb 10, 2008 8:30 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

btw I don't hate you Wink
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sylphisonic wrote:

VWA HAH HAH!!! Yes! You see, it is because I am *evil* like I said Twisted Evil . No really it is all just a personal attack on you Arrow tries to inflict pain on this "saito-geek" Arrow Wink


Geek-cat are sad now, yoo make teh funs of him Sad Wink

Sylphisonic wrote:

Yeah... you may be right. I think my head is always more in the first movie's world, where it did not feel outwardly obvious that cyberbrains were a virtual essential in life and so you didn't really think about it that way much.


That's true, The movie put a lot less emphasis on cyberbrains and prosthetics, and Motoko stood out a lot more from the people she lived amongst, with the exception maybe of Batou.

Sylphisonic wrote:

SAC would seem to be a bit more heavy on the cyberisation front. I still think that would be awful, and it strikes me as being a bit unbelievable (both in terms of the expense, and in that I don't think that such a large majority of people would ever possibly want to have cyberbrains in their heads to have caused that situation where it's an 'absolute essential' in the first place). I just don't think people would want to mess with their brains, and especially not when hacking proves to be so common (almost nobody but Section 9 could afford Section 9 level protection, for one thing). And apart from some medical benefits and added communications ability, I just don't see what the real advantages are for the common person. Why a person in general feel a great need to shove what they could carry in their handbag (GPS, credit card, cel phone etcetera) inside their brain? So they can get access to stuff that tiny bit quicker? It seems like a trivial, shallow reason. But it is a fictional world, not the real one- so I guess if the rules they're under say they're outcasts without the things, that's how they'll behave.


In the mid-1970s computer corporations couldn't conceive of any rational reason why people would need their own computer. In fact, people themselves could not even think of a reason other than few superficial geeky things they might like to do that only applied to a measured few (and I'd have been one of them, don't ya know Wink). In 1976 Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak set off down a road that ultimately changed that forever. By the mid-1990s when the Internet took hold, having apersonal computer was beciming the 'in-thing'. By the mid-2000s (i.e. now) having a personal computer or at least the skills to use one is almost compulsory in most modern western societies if you don't want to be an outcast. In another 20 years we will all carry one that will be as powerful as what we carry as a notebook/laptop today, that will fit in our hand. In 50 years I foresee you not being able to do a damn lot in western countries *without* a computer, which is sad in some ways, but that's the way it's going. Given that progression (and ignoring the vagary of the timeline Razz) I consider Shirow's vision of everyone needing a cyberbrain eventually as one that is not so far fetched. If you are ghetto without a PC in 2008, then maybe in 2108 you;ll be ghetto if you don't have a brain implant to link you to the net? That doesn't sound so unlikely to me. They call it 'progress' I believe Smile

Sylphisonic wrote:

btw I don't hate you Wink


Thank you... Smile *purrs*
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think MIT has already linked a computer directly to a human brain. I know they were working on a computer link between the brain and prostetics so people could funtion more naturely, There was a show on discovery not long ago that showed a prostetic hand linked to a computer and if it had, had more realistic skin you wouldn't have known it wasn't a fleash and blood hand. And you know scientists. No matter how they invision the outcome they will continue to push the boundries. When you think about it the neuro-net is pretty well mapped out, so basically its now a software issue. How far along they are in real life is anyones guess. I would imagine that most of the leading edge information is in some Area 51 type lab. Keep so top secret that only a few people know about it.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The stock answer to that is usually 'A lot further than anyone thinks' Smile

I swear a lot of these breakthroughs in science and you see on the news are civilian scientists performing authorised repetitions of previously undercover research. Not all are, but some seem to me a bit that way.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saito wrote:
The stock answer to that is usually 'A lot further than anyone thinks' Smile

I swear a lot of these breakthroughs in science and you see on the news are civilian scientists performing authorised repetitions of previously undercover research. Not all are, but some seem to me a bit that way.


whats the line from Jurrasic Park

"You took what other scientists did and built on it. So you don't take responciblity for it." Or something like that
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that's also known as Standing on the Shoulders of Giants. Smile

Sylphisonic wrote:
I still think that would be awful, and it strikes me as being a bit unbelievable (both in terms of the expense, and in that I don't think that such a large majority of people would ever possibly want to have cyberbrains in their heads to have caused that situation where it's an 'absolute essential' in the first place). I just don't think people would want to mess with their brains, and especially not when hacking proves to be so common (almost nobody but Section 9 could afford Section 9 level protection, for one thing). And apart from some medical benefits and added communications ability, I just don't see what the real advantages are for the common person. Why a person in general feel a great need to shove what they could carry in their handbag (GPS, credit card, cel phone etcetera) inside their brain? So they can get access to stuff that tiny bit quicker? It seems like a trivial, shallow reason. But it is a fictional world, not the real one- so I guess if the rules they're under say they're outcasts without the things, that's how they'll behave.


Going back to the topic... Wink

This is a recurring pattern with every technology, at first it's stuck in a lab or at best is used only by the military (I strongly believe they'll be the first to invest heavily in prosthetics and cyberisation - just think of the battlefield advantages!). Then it is released in the 'wild' but it's expensive, convoluted, and ultimately un-beneficial so no-one no-one sees it every becoming mainstream. Next it undergoes a series of breakthroughs, slowly increasing accessibility and reducing price and complexity. Eventually it reaches a nominal level where it's relatively safe and relatively cost effective, and also it improves along the way offering bigger advantages. There is a threshold value at which the general public will just do something because the advantages far outweigh the benefits. GPS and the Internet are two that spring to mind as things that have done this in the last 30 years. Neither are as close to the bone as cyberisation, admittedly.

What you see in SAC is a society that has been through these phases with cyberisation and now are out of the other side, into the realms where it is 'the norm'. The timeline is hopelessly compressed however, it's something I think will take at least a century to fulfill at current rates. The longest part will be convincing people it's safe. You are correct to doubt such technology and I would be skeptical also, I know how unreliable computers are at present, and having one in my brain would be a big no-no, but over that development period I described above the technology surpasses a threshold where people accept it, be honest modern PCs aren't exactly 100% reliable or 100% safe, but they are pretty good compared to what they were 10 years ago. People in the SAC universe now accept them as past that threshold. The only difference with cyberisation is that threshold is much closer to 100% than current technologies, due to it's critical nature.

As for the advantages of having a cybernetic brain? Well they are many:

Communications are direct. No picking up a device, or switching something on. It just happens, inside your head. Think it and it happens. Of course this has disadvantages too, as you correctly identify there is no 'safety barrier' provided to buffer people from hackers anymore.

Weak human mental traits are easily augmented. Math is something the human brain is not necessarily good at, save for in a gifted few. A computer in the brain would bring the best of both worlds. Consider also the ability to think something onto a canvas. For an artist that could (not always, as a lot of art is in the actual doing) be a gift.

Negating the effects of paralyzing, debilitating, or mentally eroding diseases, and physical and mental disability. Doesn't need much explanation, you already highlighted the medical benefits are a major factor.

Aid to learning difficulties. Inability to effectively read, write or process information could be computer augmented to assist the person in their work.

Enhanced senses (possibly in connection with prosthetics). In an extension of the above point, assimilation of information and environmental awareness could be augmented to provide people with more information about their surroundings. Imagine HazMat suit with a plug in the neck that linked the sensors to your brain, You'd know something was wrong before a 'normal' person could even have thought to look up. Of course, this could also be very scary in the wrong situation, especially if you are trapped and have no way out.

I'm sure I can think of a lot more given a few hours and a pencil and pad, but those are just a few examples.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes yes, several medical benefits etcetera. I can tell who would be the first to line up if all this was ever really available (most of the people here, LOL!!)...

Quote:
By the mid-2000s (i.e. now) having a personal computer or at least the skills to use one is almost compulsory in most modern western societies if you don't want to be an outcast.


Well, talking about the current times I wouldn't exaggerate quite that far just yet. There is still no computer in my mother's house, unless I am staying there for a while, lol. She does not know how to switch it on, much less feel like she would ever need it (I tried to show her, but I don't think she really liked it or remembered how to do it). This has not impacted her life at all, as far as I know. It seems to be the case that there are many people in their 40s, 50s and 60s like my mother who have little to no computer skills at all. And I personally have never had a job or anything like that that ever required me to know how to do anything on a computer (except for get a CV typed up, lol). Granted they weren't jobs that required typing up reports or data entry or anything like that; but I'm just saying that at the moment there are still plenty of areas in society where a computer isn't really required yet to lead a "decent" life.

Mind you, you are talking to the girl who still has never owned a cel phone, lol... (I have literally only ever touched one about 20 times in my whole life so far, though admittedly it's on the increase since I finally worked out how to use Jeff's one [to get lifts home from uni, lol]). I will admit that that piece of technology totally took off in a way I'd never have expected it to. It still feels completely unnecessary to me, but then I'm not really a person who feels a need to be constantly socially connected, or to constantly feel the assurance that my phone is 'there' if I need it. Perhaps evolution is going to leave me behind- I just can't throw myself behind technology 100%, because sometimes what we think we need seems ridiculous to me (there again, what I think I need in my life probably sounds ridiculous to the next person. I am often in the minority).

Quote:
In another 20 years we will all carry one that will be as powerful as what we carry as a notebook/laptop today, that will fit in our hand.


Okay, I definately want that though ^_^. I really want something like Aki's holographic wrist computer from Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within. That just... looks cool Cool

Quote:
Thank you... *purrs*


Yeesh, he *purred* at me? Wahhh, kowaii!! Arrow runs away. (LOL, I'm more of a... big dog person, probably Wink . Cats often hate me for some reason. Except for the nice kitties, of course)
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sylphisonic wrote:
Yes yes, several medical benefits etcetera. I can tell who would be the first to line up if all this was ever really available (most of the people here, LOL!!)...


I don't know as I would, I was just staking a supporting case.

Sylphisonic wrote:

Well, talking about the current times I wouldn't exaggerate quite that far just yet.


I guess it hasn't moved on quite as far where you are. I was talking as a UK citizen, we are a small island so stuff develops fast once it takes hold.

Sylphisonic wrote:

There is still no computer in my mother's house, unless I am staying there for a while, lol. She does not know how to switch it on, much less feel like she would ever need it (I tried to show her, but I don't think she really liked it or remembered how to do it). This has not impacted her life at all, as far as I know.


Not directly, but many aspects of your life are influenced by computer control somewhere along the line, and most of the time people never even realise.

Sylphisonic wrote:

It seems to be the case that there are many people in their 40s, 50s and 60s like my mother who have little to no computer skills at all.


That is true, but in a lot of cases this is simply because no-one has taken the time to teach them, not because they can't actually do it. I'm not saying your own methods are wrong or flawed, but you need a great deal of determination and ability to explain stuff us younger folk take for granted as 'just knowing' in order to teach them.

Sylphisonic wrote:

And I personally have never had a job or anything like that that ever required me to know how to do anything on a computer (except for get a CV typed up, lol). Granted they weren't jobs that required typing up reports or data entry or anything like that;


Not even an electronic cash register?

Sylphisonic wrote:

but I'm just saying that at the moment there are still plenty of areas in society where a computer isn't really required yet to lead a "decent" life.


I suppose you are right, perhaps I jumper the gun a little. Perhaps I am guilty of a little Shirow-esque timeline compression too Wink

Sylphisonic wrote:

Mind you, you are talking to the girl who still has never owned a cel phone, lol... (I have literally only ever touched one about 20 times in my whole life so far, though admittedly it's on the increase since I finally worked out how to use Jeff's one [to get lifts home from uni, lol]). I will admit that that piece of technology totally took off in a way I'd never have expected it to. It still feels completely unnecessary to me, but then I'm not really a person who feels a need to be constantly socially connected, or to constantly feel the assurance that my phone is 'there' if I need it.


I can understand why people carry a mobile phone, what I can't understand is why they have to have all the crap on it that clogs it up. Even though I have a lot of stuff on my phone most people don't (e-mail, IRC, IMs, GPS) I am not a compulsive user. Truth be told I could do without all that and just have a phone. Why do you needs games, music, TV and all that crap on it (I'm not against cameras, I think people should take more photos)? Are people's attentions spans so short in this day and age they needs such an eclectic mix of attention sapping rubbish on their phones? Whatever happened to carrying a book to read on the train. The point is that 'accessory' features on most phones are gimmicks, made to sell to a young public who need another reason to own a new one. I can sympathize with anyone who doesn't want a mobile phone, mobile phones as they exist today are a scourge of cheap crap and stupid noises. There are at least signs of this changing for the better however.

Sylphisonic wrote:

Perhaps evolution is going to leave me behind- I just can't throw myself behind technology 100%, because sometimes what we think we need seems ridiculous to me (there again, what I think I need in my life probably sounds ridiculous to the next person. I am often in the minority).


There is much confusion between what people 'need' and what people 'want' in todays society. Far too many people substitute want for need, and as a result society is demanding stuff that just is not necessary. A large part of technology marketing is based on this 'see it - need it' ethos.
It's something that personally I find distasteful. To be someone who can appreciate technology, but not end up burying oneself in it for the sake of it, is a state probably much more favourable, and one I could only aspire to, sadly, as I am a long way down that road and only coming to realise too late where it leads. I guess that;s why I cling to forums and contacts through the internet, as a justification for all this madness.

However, I have not sunk so far that I cannot see a life outside. Regrettably some people are so hollow that their life attached to a computer really *is* all they have. In that sense I almost feel in a similar situation to Togusa, in that I put my life, family, and friends before anything else, and refuse to let technology get the better of my principles.

Sylphisonic wrote:

Okay, I definately want that though ^_^. I really want something like Aki's holographic wrist computer from Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within. That just... looks cool Cool


I can't promise holographic projection, or something small enough to fit on the wrist, at least not in 20 years, but I do see powerful technology getting smaller every day.

Sylphisonic wrote:

Yeesh, he *purred* at me? Wahhh, kowaii!! Arrow runs away. (LOL, I'm more of a... big dog person, probably Wink . Cats often hate me for some reason. Except for the nice kitties, of course)


I'm nice, I even smile when I'm pulling up the corners of your carpet, or running up your curtains Very Happy
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I guess it hasn't moved on quite as far where you are. I was talking as a UK citizen, we are a small island so stuff develops fast once it takes hold.


Things spread like wildfire there, that is true (the mobile phone revolution took a grand total of 4 weeks max before every single person at school had one... they literally went from "forgotten bricks of the 80s" to must-have accessories over a one month period where I was. I kept wondering how the hell everyone had afforded them- even the little 6 year olds you used to see with them).

Quote:
That is true, but in a lot of cases this is simply because no-one has taken the time to teach them, not because they can't actually do it.


It's not necessarily because no-one is willing to teach. They refuse to want to learn or see why you are saying it will be good / useful for them. I don't really see a problem with this if that is how people really strongly feel though. A person who doesn't really want to learn or is far too daunted by it all to learn (or maybe both) will find it much harder and maybe can't learn altogether. You can write it down and explain slowly a hundred times, but if someone is not keen on switching the machine on they're not going to do it, and if their life is set up so they can get by well without actually needing to, then they're not going to do it. There's not a great deal to be done about it after a while except to keep the door open for them if they decide to try to learn later.

I guess one should also respect their wishes if it's a, "Don't need a TV, don't need a computer; just a simple lifestyle without distractions," sort of thing. Some people get stressed or depressed by living with reminders of work or modern stress like electronic noise and screens etc in their everyday environment.

Quote:
Not even an electronic cash register?


Nope. I've never been a shop assistant.

Quote:
Togusa, in that I put my life, family, and friends before anything else, and refuse to let technology get the better of my principles.


Yay! Good for you, that is a good policy!


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sylphisonic wrote:
Uhh... I am a UK citizen. Things spread like wildfire in London, that is true (the mobile phone revolution took a grand total of 4 weeks max before every single person at school and in my family -besides me- had one... they literally went from "forgotten bricks of the 80s" to must-have accessories over a one month period where I was. I kept wondering how the hell everyone had afforded them- even the little 6 year olds you used to see with them).


The whole 'keeping up with the Joneses' mentality is one of the human traits most commonly that drives me beserk. I don't understand why people can't take what they've got and be happy. Replace your phone when it breaks. Buy your kids one when they are A) old enough to use it and B) actually need it. It's the same with cars, computers, houses, jobs, where people live. It's insane.

Sylphisonic wrote:

It's not because no-one is willing to teach. They refuse to want to learn or see why you are saying it will be good / useful for them. I don't really see a problem with this if that is how people really strongly feel though. A person who doesn't really want to learn or is far too daunted by it all to learn (or maybe both) will find it much harder and maybe can't learn altogether. You can right it down and explain slowly a hundred times, but if someone is not keen on switching the machine on they're not going to do it, and if life is set up so they can get by well without actually needing to, then they're not going to do it and that is just life. Some people also refuse to learn anything about studying history, geography or science because they are too daunted and lack interest in the whole thing; there's not a great deal to be done about it after a while except to keep a door open.


This is a problem that can be solved by effective teaching. The problem is there are seldom any effective teachers out there, especially in my field. Most people that want to teach you IT and computers do so shockingly badly. That approach has no value-added benefits. In my experience the whole thing with people resisting technology fiercely is simply a fear of the unknown, a fear that the added complication and learning will just make their life harder. What you have to do is to get across to these people that there are enormous personal, social and intellectual benefits to learning how to do all this stuff. As with any teaching you can teach a lot of people something they aren't interested in normally as long as you make it fun, interesting and valuable. Most IT training is about spinning fast buck off people. That sickens me because it's the wrong approach and it pushes people away, rather than drawing them in.
The other problem is the systems themselves. Computers are all powerful these days, yet they are 100 times more complex to use than they were in the 1980s when I first started out. In some cases this is unavoidable and the operations you perform on them are inherently more complex, such as touching up and editing photos, making a home movie etc. But a lot of operations that could be so simple are made insanely complex by complacency and reliance on old established paradigms. It refuses to get any better too, and that pisses me off because again it's driving people away who could get benefit and enjoyment out of the technology.
The industry is filled with money grinders and is devoid of the sufficient numbers of people who actually want to help people. It all comes down to money in the end...

Quote:

Yay! Good for you, that is a good policy ^_^


Well lets face it, what's more fun, going out for a night on the town with your best friends in the world or sitting in front of a computer playing World of Warcraft with a bunch of people you only less-than-half know? Okay, I can call an exception here because I went out for a night on the town with 2 guys I met in an MMOG but we ended up becoming really good buddies and it was all a jolly good laugh. Proof, though, that even then in fact, that it's the human interaction part of life that is the best part.

I love my technology stuff and I find it fascinating, occasionally thrilling and intellectually stimulating, as well as extensions to the paradigm like GiTS (which is why GiTS fascinates me so much). t the end of the day it's not human, though, it has no life of it's own. The biggest yhing for me that technology has brought to me is not uber HaXor skillz or a living as a coder, but the ability to find, and interact with, people. In some very great cases those interactions have gone beyond the internet and computers and become real, genuine friendships. I would no more want to put a computer between myself and my best friends than want to cut out my own tongue, but I have to because that's the only way I can communicate with them a lot of the time.

Techonology. Embrace it. Use it. Know it's Limits.
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Joined: 14 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that togusa was put into the team for the very reason that he was not enhanced cybernetically. his ideas about cyberisation and the differentiation between ghost and machine were needed as an insight for the functioning of section 9.
Evil or Very Mad And whats with the fool! I like togusa the best after the major!!! Evil or Very Mad
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